It may soon be possible to create "mirror life"

(economist.com)

29 points | by amai 2 hours ago

13 comments

  • tomaskafka 3 minutes ago
    Finally, we built a mirror bacteria from the famous "Don't create a mirror bacteria" paper.
  • boesboes 34 minutes ago
    Or maybe we could focus on something not world ending for once?
    • amelius 4 minutes ago
      Yeah, what if this behaves like prions?
    • embedding-shape 32 minutes ago
      What do you do for work? I'm sure we can figure out how it also contributes to ending the world, one way or another :)
      • AnimalMuppet 26 minutes ago
        Challenge accepted.

        I worked for this company that did telephone service for the hard of hearing. It was a phone that could go very loud. It also captioned the far end of the phone call, in case the user couldn't pick out all the words, even with the high volume.

        I await your world-ending scenario for that tech and/or company.

        • vconnor 14 minutes ago
          > Challenge accepted.

          Ironically, this is the type of mindset of scientists that do this type of dangerous research. Just to see if it’s possible, with no concern of ethics ever bothering them.

        • Almondsetat 20 minutes ago
          Captioning? If the company used novel techniques you contributed to the surveillance state, you're welcome
        • peddling-brink 22 minutes ago
          If any life destroys all life, it will be humans destroying all life. So any human promoting act is a contribution to the destruction of all life.

          Dolphins are advanced enough, we should let them take it from here.

  • sir_eliah 16 minutes ago
    There's a series of books from Petter Watts that give plenty of good reasons why this might not be the best idea:

    - "Starfish"

    - "Maelstrom"

    - "βehemoth"

    • aeve890 13 minutes ago
      >βehemoth

      How I read that? Like Ssehemoth or like Behemoth?

      • sir_eliah 9 minutes ago
        I'm glad you asked! Obviously you have to check the code table and you can see that's a Greek beta, not German Eszett. \s

          In [1]: ord("β")
          Out[1]: 946
        
          In [2]: ord("ß")
          Out[2]: 223
  • vinni2 20 minutes ago
  • mrlonglong 33 minutes ago
    This has the potential to destroy all life.
    • sscaryterry 10 minutes ago
      I'm sure nature has already tried these "mirror" forms, and for efficiency/practicality reasons, discarded them.
    • api 24 minutes ago
      Hyperbole aside, has the risk of this been truly studied?

      All I hear is "there's no danger" or "OMG this will kill us all" and in neither case is any reason given.

  • vouaobrasil 10 minutes ago
    This sort of thing highlights the most dangerous thing about a high-tech society: people will do ANYTHING to cure a disease they or their loved ones have, even if it means an existential risk that we often have the ability of instantiating.

    Obviously not worth it, but to the person who themselves face an existential risk, the level of absurd justification from the instinct to survive will always trump sanity.

  • otikik 1 minute ago
    "Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn’t stop to think if they should"
  • scotty79 21 minutes ago
    It's nowhere close to being possible. To do anything related to life you need to have a lot of complex molecules. When you do things with normal life you can have genetically modified organisms that will produce whatever substance you need in whatever amount you need.

    To get mirror substances you need to create them chemically which is PITA even if possible.

    I highly recommend watching an interview with a person that achieved best results so far with creating artificial normal (for some definitions of normal) almost life from the grounds up.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4WywVQfIV4

    There is a section of whether this kind of work enables creation mirror life as well.

  • nemomarx 41 minutes ago
    what exactly would we usefully get from doing it?
    • nativeit 35 minutes ago
      The primary proposed benefit of creating mirror-image organisms is as a means to mass-produce mirror-image forms of molecules that are produced by normal life. Mirror-image molecules have been studied for several decades and may offer a range of potential applications. There is broad agreement among scientists that it is important to distinguish between mirror-image molecules and whole mirror-image organisms. Some scientists argue that chemical synthesis methods are sufficient for creating mirror-image molecules without posing the potentially catastrophic risks of mirror-image organisms.

      Potential applications of mirror-image molecules include:

      Enantiopure drugs: Some pharmaceuticals show different activity depending on enantiomeric form.

      L-ribonucleic acid aptamers: Artificial oligonucleotides that are constructed from the mirror-image versions of their natural forms. L-RNA aptamers are highly resistant to degradation by nucleases and are currently being tested in clinical trials.

      L-glucose, enantiomer of standard glucose: Tests showed that it tastes likes standard sugar, but is not metabolized the same way. However, it was never marketed due to excessive manufacturing costs. More recent research allows cheap production with high yields; however the authors state that it is not usable as a sweetener due to laxative effects.

      [From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror-image_life]

    • umvi 11 minutes ago
      As a diabetic, I would love "mirror wheat" which behaves like normal wheat (ie can make breads, etc) but has zero carbs/calories because the body can't digest it. Mirror glucose would be nice too, though allulose is already a pretty close stand in for mirror glucose.
    • tracerbulletx 6 minutes ago
      A stronger understanding of organic chemistry.
    • adzm 36 minutes ago
      We already make use of "mirror" molecules; the idea is that mirror organisms could help efficiently create these for us (like how we can use yeast and fungi etc to create various chemicals).

      Of course there is also the whole potential apocalypse scenario

    • aatd86 28 minutes ago
      I had read somewhere that it could allow the creation of cures that would not trigger the immune system, since they would use chirality to hide, so to speak.
      • functionmouse 26 minutes ago
        Yes, we will work on life forms undetectable to the immune system. For uh, checks notes cures. Disregard the fact that the imperial military runs our society.
    • ceejayoz 39 minutes ago
      Stuff our immune system doesn't recognize is potentially useful for things like vaccine delivery. But it's also useful for a potential pathogen.
    • xyzal 36 minutes ago
      weapons
  • amai 2 hours ago
    • chasil 38 minutes ago
      The "Potential Risks" section of the wiki is a bit thin on the mechanisms of the danger.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror-image_life#Potential_ri...

      'In December 2024, 38 scientists, including several synthetic biology researchers and two Nobel laureates, warned that the creation of mirror-image life could cause "unprecedented and irreversible harm" to human health and ecosystems worldwide. The reversed structure of mirror-image bacteria could allow them to evade many mechanisms critical for immunity and predation that have evolved to recognize natural-chirality structures. As a result, mirror-image bacteria could potentially escape immune defenses and invade natural ecosystems, leading to "pervasive lethal infections in a substantial fraction of plant and animal species, including humans."'

      • intrasight 27 minutes ago
        You don't need a mirror image organism to cause great harm. An engineered prion could also be devastating.

        I don't think preons are technically mirror molecules, but it's close enough from a risk perspective. If rogue AI were to do us in through bioengineering, it might be by creating a novel prion.

        • rwmj 20 minutes ago
          So that's two things we shouldn't be releasing into the world.
    • ceejayoz 44 minutes ago
      TL;DR: Don't.
  • unddoch 27 minutes ago
    I really doubt a "mirror life" bacteria would be "hidden" from the immune system. Antibodies should have enough search space to be able to detect and neutralise such bacteria?
    • tim-star 8 minutes ago
      well, you are the expert!

      more seriously: how would it be able search for something it has no experience seeing at all