Louis Rossmann is currently trying to get Hakko to release schematics and parts lists, but they're presently hiding behind distributor-channel knowledge-hoarding and "no longer available" planned obsolescence.
... and there are reasons for the rollover odometer meme too.
Is the supposition that they didn't need the digit until recently? I doubt that was a concern - if any, more financial/cosmetic than engineering.
The older cars didn't fail spectacularly. The used car market is made mostly of these repairable cars.
Again, they lasted long enough for the odometer rollover... but also for Toyota trucks to become an icon. These 'junkers' (said lovingly) are how 'everyone' in the Midwest learns to drive and gets to their first job, too.
I'll close with my own crazy assertion! Leases are for people so bored with their work, they need financial commitments to spice things up
> The older cars didn't fail spectacularly. The used car market is made mostly of these repairable cars.
Well, we need to specify which ages of car we are talking about.
The used car market is probably mostly made of cars built in the last twenty years. I also had even older times in mind, all the way from Model T to today.
Modern cars certainly have improvements in those areas; I'm not dismissing that. Just... the engineering and tolerances didn't 'have' to be as good. The performance numbers weren't nearly as good - that afforded a lot.
They were primitive, and if the manufacturer chose it to be, robust as a result. The alternative was cheap.
Like the Death Star meme, every mechanical thing has a weak point. Well-designed cars put the stuff that breaks in cheap consumable parts in an easy to reach place.
That last piece can have more impact on the price of a repair than the part itself
Not the latest lot that replaced physical instruments and switches with LED screens. It's going to be hard to find replacements for those in the near future. While you can 3d-scan and machine a physical part you cannot fab displays once the production stops.
The Henry Ford Museum also maintains a whole fleet of them that ferry people around the grounds, you can ride one, and you can watch a live demonstration of one being taken completely apart and reassembled every afternoon.
Many of the parts can still be made on site in the museum's workshops, too.
In SE Michigan, you can't swing a stunned cat without hitting an automobile museum. The are lots of people, clubs, businesses and museums to keep these things going.
I would bet making parts for it is not super hard, and that there is also probably a whole market for those parts from the museum/antique restoration crowd.
> Would love to know how they maintain it, eg replacement parts.
Total speculation: I'd bet some combination of collector interest keeping parts available and the relative ease of manufacture of such parts using modern techniques.
Yep. There's a viable collector/restoration market for these cars, the parts are all very simple and not particularly tolerance-critical by modern standards, and easy to recreate with all the plans available.
Reminds me of the accidental Wikipedia dive into the "Volkswagen engine" universe I once had: apparently the design lives on in a multitude of engines in the ultralight market, for dune buggies and the like. Bootstrapped by aftermarket parts for repurposed original engines, but then complete engines appeared making use of those aftermarket parts and now it's an interoperability standard long after repurposing original engines has stopped being a thing. Distributed Theseus.
I would propose gutting it and replacing the engine with something modern. A moped probably has equivalent oomph. Or the heretical option and install EV motors directly onto the wheels.
In this region of NY our bigger concern is visibility in the winter and at night. Our lawmakers sat down with various local community leaders to hammer out a voluntary agreement to go beyond state visibility laws.
How cool would it be if at some point they used one of the original electric Model Ts - perhaps with a bigger battery to achieve more than it's original 80 mile range.
I think the comment refers to the Detroit Electric cars, because it was driven a lot by Clara Ford. I am guessing their range is due to them going 32kmh/20mph and being loaded with 530kg/1170lbs of batteries.
Big batteries and low speeds? Also 80 was the advertised “reliable range”.
The “normal” T had double to triple the range, at double the speed.
and I don’t think there ever was an electric T, there were barebones prototype frames. What people call electric Ts are usually Detroit Electrics (the specs match).
A running Ford Model T likely costs absurd amounts of money to maintain because everything about it is likely custom, especially when something breaks.
That's true. I'm doubtful anyone has ever done offset crash testing of a Model T. From what it sounds like, this specific vehicle is driven slow for safety of others and possibly safety of occupants do, and likely not to wear and stress this functional relic as much either.
The risk will be a collision from behind, or a collision from the side at a junction.
In every case I'd rather be in the Fiat 500. The only benefit might be the Model T attracting more attention, but some flashing lights and a garish "Road Maintenance" paint scheme could solve that for the Fiat.
A quick bit of Google research suggests that a WWII Jeep would also serve this purpose. But it would be shameful to use a vehicle from Ohio.
In any case, I'm not an expert in cars or what people need from their car. I would assume that the people who buy cars know what they want.
That's actually the crux of my ire. To sell more... things are made more cheaply.
I know all too well how much money it costs to be poor. Now that I have means, I'd rather buy one good version than many not good ones.
The thing is, the good options are disappearing because incentives suck. People are happy to buy disposable garbage, they enjoy consuming. I don't.
There's still lots of high-quality expensive options available in many product categories.
Now, most people expect nearly 200k. More if you do proper maintenance (namely preventing rusting)
Is the supposition that they didn't need the digit until recently? I doubt that was a concern - if any, more financial/cosmetic than engineering.
The older cars didn't fail spectacularly. The used car market is made mostly of these repairable cars.
Again, they lasted long enough for the odometer rollover... but also for Toyota trucks to become an icon. These 'junkers' (said lovingly) are how 'everyone' in the Midwest learns to drive and gets to their first job, too.
I'll close with my own crazy assertion! Leases are for people so bored with their work, they need financial commitments to spice things up
Well, we need to specify which ages of car we are talking about.
The used car market is probably mostly made of cars built in the last twenty years. I also had even older times in mind, all the way from Model T to today.
Anything older is legally defined as a classic, to my knowledge. Most of those are either proper junk or collectibles. Not what I'm talking about.
The engineering and tolerances on an 80’s/90’s car just isn’t as good as a modern car. That lead to a lot of premature failures on major components.
They were primitive, and if the manufacturer chose it to be, robust as a result. The alternative was cheap.
Like the Death Star meme, every mechanical thing has a weak point. Well-designed cars put the stuff that breaks in cheap consumable parts in an easy to reach place.
That last piece can have more impact on the price of a repair than the part itself
You are right that lots of those components will be hard to find as replacement in the future.
Many of the parts can still be made on site in the museum's workshops, too.
https://www.modeltford.com/ claims to sell new and used parts.
Total speculation: I'd bet some combination of collector interest keeping parts available and the relative ease of manufacture of such parts using modern techniques.
https://www.nysenate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2015/patty-...
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/
1 - https://www.thehenryford.org/collections-and-research/digita...
https://www.thehenryford.org/collections-and-research/digita...
The “normal” T had double to triple the range, at double the speed.
and I don’t think there ever was an electric T, there were barebones prototype frames. What people call electric Ts are usually Detroit Electrics (the specs match).
We've got one in the local car museum, it gets driven out and about every 18 months or so.
Crackin' fuel efficiency: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isetta
https://youtu.be/ekRoVb0qfAY?t=39
In every case I'd rather be in the Fiat 500. The only benefit might be the Model T attracting more attention, but some flashing lights and a garish "Road Maintenance" paint scheme could solve that for the Fiat.